Zen's Bizarre Choices #7

[Zens7s]

Would you rather...

A) Cheat on your spouse and have nobody know; or
B) Not cheat and have everyone think you did

Women might be able to fake orgasms, but men can fake entire relationships.
-Sharon Stone

Honesty is the key to relationships. If you can fake that, you're in.
-Monica (on Friends)

There is one thing I would break up over and that is if she caught me with another woman. I wouldn't stand for that.
-Steve Martin

[By-tor]

Crap, Zens, I been married 24 freakin' years. Never cheated once. I couldn't live with myself if my wife thought I cheated on her. In fact I'd probably come clean if I ever did(not the smartest thing to do). But to answer the question, I'd go with B, until I could get the bitch that spread the rumor in the same room with my wife and beat the truth out of her.

[TLS]

There is something absurdly interesting about choice B.
Seeing as how I'm a potential cheater -I could cheat whenever I want, but having the opportunity to be right when everyone else is wrong- that's something (in my case) just doesn't happen to often.
Besides guilt wouldn't give me that same kind of satisfaction.
I choose B.

[bwdial]

A.
I'd rather deal with guilt internally. My parents trained me to do that well.

[Zens7s]

A.
I'd rather deal with guilt internally. My parents trained me to do that well.
Are you Catholic? ;)

[Razorback]

Would you rather...

A) Cheat on your spouse and have nobody know; or
B) Not cheat and have everyone think you did


If you cheat then you will feel guilty. If people think you cheated then they will make you feel guilty, regardless. So, either way, you are screwed.

But I would choose B because if I ever cheated I would feel compelled to confess.

[Zens7s]

I vote A. It would drive me INSANE to be accused of something I didn't do. Plus, if everyone including your signifigant other thought it were true, you would end up losing everything over nothing. That's the sort of thing that drives a person to cash in their chips and Uzi the dealer at the local casino.

At least with the other option you alone have to deal with the guilt of what you have done, and that is punishment.

I have always said that I think the whole "unburdening your conscience" part is really unfair. I think you should have to interalize it instead of sharing it with the other person and make them feel like a trainwreck with you. It's ultimately a selfish gesture, disguised as "I just couldn't live with myself."

[Razorback]

I vote A. It would drive me INSANE to be accused of something I didn't do. Plus, if everyone including your signifigant other thought it were true, you would end up losing everything over nothing. That's the sort of thing that drives a person to cash in their chips and Uzi the dealer at the local casino.

At least with the other option you alone have to deal with the guilt of what you have done, and that is punishment.

I remember a friend of mine dealing with something like this, where his wife and her friends all thought he had cheated. He swore up and down that he never had.... and then said to me "I should just cheat so that I can feel guilty about what they are making me feel guilty about!"

The problem I see with this argument is.... character is built on doing what is right when no one is looking. Someone who does good things and then requires praise is someone who does good things to receive praise. Someone who does something wrong and requires that people forgive that wrong is someone who is, more likely than not, incapable of learning from that wrong.

Not that I am judging you, or anyone who would choose A (this is a blanket judgement that doesn't take into consideration the actual uniqueness of some people). I am simply saying that wanting to take guilt more than being aware of your own character (when everyone else is unaware of it) is, perhaps, a short sighted decision.

Let me add (in an edit), that we have talked about this "passing the buck of guilt" before, and I think you discount the fact that many people WANT to know if they have been cheated on. To tell them nothing and feel guilt for having done it, does not give them the opportunity to punish you as they (the wronged) deserve. By not telling someone that you cheated, and staying with them when you know they would probably leave you if they knew, robs them of knowledge about you and the relationship that they deserve to know.

So, keeping it inside is not as honorable of a gesture if it means that the other person would punish you worse than you would punish yourself for having done it.

[Mighty Wingman]

I vote A. It would drive me INSANE to be accused of something I didn't do. Plus, if everyone including your signifigant other thought it were true, you would end up losing everything over nothing. That's the sort of thing that drives a person to cash in their chips and Uzi the dealer at the local casino.

At least with the other option you alone have to deal with the guilt of what you have done, and that is punishment.

I have always said that I think the whole "unburdening your conscience" part is really unfair. I think you should have to interalize it instead of sharing it with the other person and make them feel like a trainwreck with you. It's ultimately a selfish gesture, disguised as "I just couldn't live with myself."

You make a valid point, But I would still choose B because I never cheat.

[Zens7s]

I see your side of it also. My judgment may be slightly clouded currently. I am thinking about knowledge of such things after a break up. It almost has the feeling like you are being kicked when you are already down. Does it really matter, after the fact, if the person cheated on you? Done is done. I have found that the "I cheated" conversation almost always comes up after the breakup. It's doesn't change one single thing about the situation. You did it. Live with the consequences.

I have the often bad propensity to give all people I date enough rope to hang themselves with. The side effect is that almost everyone I have ever dated has hung themselves and then eventually unburdened their conscience on me. After a while it starts to feel, whether justified or not, that you are the kind of person who does not satisfy the people you love. I know that in reality it's much less about you and much more about them, but it doesn't change the fact that the other thinking creeps in.

Sure, there are people that want to know every detail of why their lover is gone. For others it's enough that they are gone, and the unspoken evils they visited upon them aren't really important anymore. Knowing too much about them can be the stuff that really messes you up for the next one. Especially when you REALLY didn't see it coming...so then in the next person you start to look for things that aren't even there to avoid being the fool again.

I also think you may be interpreting my choice of 'A' as saying I would rather cheat and that is a character flaw. I was thinking instead of the general sense of false accusation, specifically because I don't cheat. I just would prefer to have actually done what I was accused of, than being crucified for something I haven't done. Nobody expects a Spanish Inquisition. :)

With choice B it makes me wonder what I was doing that caused everyone to think I cheated?

[Razorback]

I have found that the "I cheated" conversation almost always comes up after the breakup. It's doesn't change one single thing about the situation. You did it. Live with the consequences.

But it matters a great deal if you are still with the person. If you are already broken up then it probably won't change anything.

I also think you may be interpreting my choice of 'A' as saying I would rather cheat and that is a character flaw.

Actually, what I originally stated, but deleted, was that I think you have more character than choice A. I deleted it since you could then easily say "well, you don't know me as well as I know myself." :)

With choice B it makes me wonder what I was doing that caused everyone to think I cheated?

Well, that is another matter for consideration. Why would so many people think you cheated? You were probably doing something cheat-like. Time to stop. ;)

[bwdial]

Are you Catholic? ;)

Strangely enough...no. Not Jewish either. Didn't even go to church as a child, so they managed to create an amazing amount of guilt without the specter of God watching. Jedi fucking masters they were.

[Zens7s]

But it matters a great deal if you are still with the person. If you are already broken up then it probably won't change anything.True. I guess if you are still with the person you should know, even just in the health sense (were they careful, etc.). Then you can determine what to do from there.



Actually, what I originally stated, but deleted, was that I think you have more character than choice A. I deleted it since you could then easily say "well, you don't know me as well as I know myself." :)It is not in my character to cheat, but it is in my character to be driven crazy by accusation. I couldn't stay in a relationship where I wasn't trusted, because one of my character traits is straightforward honesty with my partner. If the person trusts me so little, then it's doomed.



Well, that is another matter for consideration. Why would so many people think you cheated? You were probably doing something cheat-like. Time to stop. ;)I think there is more than just physical infidelity. There is usually a history of emotional infidelity before that. Just because you haven't done the deed doesn't mean that the groundwork you are laying isn't grounds for termination. What did your friend do to get in trouble with their other?

[Razorback]

What did your friend do to get in trouble with their other?

He was madly in love with another woman. :)

[Zens7s]

He was madly in love with another woman. :)
HEE HEE! Exactly!

He was running the 800 in the "Emotional Infidelity Games", he just hadn't reached the finish line yet.

[Razorback]

HEE HEE! Exactly!

He was running the 800 in the "Emotional Infidelity Games", he just hadn't reached the finish line yet.

Yep. But he didn't admit it until I gave him "the look" (as my friends call it). Then he said "Oh, Razor, I can't lie to you! I am crazy about The Incubus!"

I told him that I was going to call his wife and tell her the truth if he didn't do something about it. He then promised that he would. They are still together and have a nice baby boy. All is well. :) I think he came to me with the problem because he knew I would not tell him what his other friends were telling him.

He knew I would kick his ass. I think that is what he wanted. Someone to tell him that there was no excuse for what he was doing (even if he had not "cheated" yet).

[Zens7s]

Yep. But he didn't admit it until I gave him "the look" (as my friends call it). Then he said "Oh, Razor, I can't lie to you! I am crazy about The Incubus!"

I told him that I was going to call his wife and tell her the truth if he didn't do something about it. He then promised that he would. They are still together and have a nice baby boy. All is well. :) I think he came to me with the problem because he knew I would not tell him what his other friends were telling him.

He knew I would kick his ass. I think that is what he wanted. Someone to tell him that there was no excuse for what he was doing (even if he had not "cheated" yet).
That is such an easy trap to fall into also. It happens so much, especially at work. You start spending so much time with someone, and you don't have to deal with the reality of them...just the idea of them. Then you go home to your real significant other and they look so un-fun, or naggy, or wearing their sweat pants for the 12th day in a row. It never registers that the other intruder has the same pair of sweatpants at home, you just don't see them.

[Razorback]

That is such an easy trap to fall into also. It happens so much, especially at work. You start spending so much time with someone, and you don't have to deal with the reality of them...just the idea of them. Then you go home to your real significant other and they look so un-fun, or naggy, or wearing their sweat pants for the 12th day in a row. It never registers that the other intruder has the same pair of sweatpants at home, you just don't see them.

Exactly. The fantasy is always better than the reality. Until you lose the reality, and then it becomes your fantasy.

[jjcourtright]

Would you rather...

A) Cheat on your spouse and have nobody know; orNobody would know? Are you saying that I'm bad in bed?

[Zens7s]

Exactly. The fantasy is always better than the reality. Until you lose the reality, and then it becomes your fantasy.
It sort of brings to mind my really depressing theory about relationships in the 21st century. Being with the reality of someone for a lifetime isn't what it used to be...literally.

Back in the day most people kicked the bucket by their late twenties. It was pretty easy to promise "til death do us part" when that only meant about 5-10 years max. These days you are promising to live with the sweat pant queen and holes in their t-shirt king for 50-60 years.

[TLS]

Nobody would know? Are you saying that I'm bad in bed?
Good question. Though maybe she's one of those weirdo's who thinks that self-love is a form of cheating. ;)

[Zens7s]

Nobody would know? Are you saying that I'm bad in bed?
Well, it's like that "Clint" problem Wingman had...RB claimed that she remembered, even if she didn't admit it. :)

[Zens7s]

Good question. Though maybe she's one of those weirdo's who thinks that self-love is a form of cheating. ;)
If that is true then I have cheated on everybody I have ever dated, and was UNCONTROLLABLE in my disregard for fidelity.

[Razorback]

It sort of brings to mind my really depressing theory about relationships in the 21st century. Being with the reality of someone for a lifetime isn't what it used to be...literally.

Back in the day most people kicked the bucket by their late twenties. It was pretty easy to promise "til death do us part" when that only meant about 5-10 years max. These days you are promising to live with the sweat pant queen and holes in their t-shirt king for 50-60 years.

It is part of why I don't see much of a point in marriage unless you have an "open relationship."

Not that I cannot be with one person for the rest of my life, but why limit yourself when both of you can have so much fun together with more people? :D

I understand why people fall in love and stay together for the rest of their lives. I just don't feel like I would want to limit our fun to only each other.

[ILovePapaSmurf]

[b]Would you rather...

A) Cheat on your spouse and have nobody know; or
B) Not cheat and have everyone think you did


Tough one, but with A I think I would tell the person that I cheated on right away. Just because I can't hold back any secrets. And then B, well, that might easier to handle because many people at school confused me as the girl who got fucked in the port-o-potty until I told her off in front of a huge crowd at school... then she preceeded to poor Sprite on top of my head.. So I think I would go with B because at the end of the day, no matter what people think of you, it shouldn't matter. The people who know you, really know you, and the others, well, they can just kiss your ass.

[Omaru]

I go for B as long as they think it was with someone who resembles Eva Longoria or Sativa Rose (don't ask who.)

Otherwise A is the safer but more immoral option.

[Zens7s]

Bump so the newbies can contribute.

[FanGirl]

I somehow missed this one the first time.

I'd go with B. I could never cheat and I'm used to people thinking I've done stuff that I haven't and at the strangest times too. I was hooking up with my best friend's roommate who could not believe I never hooked up with my best friend. I was like "Umm..no and talking about him isn't exactly the best foreplay."

[sedriyke]

I choose B, one- because ive never cheated on anyone, and B- because if everyone thought i was cheating, and it came down to them telling the person i did love, if it meant losing her I'd do everything i could to get the evidence proving me right, and considering i didnt cheat, I know I'd have a solid case.

[ratm1966]

Hmmm, another one I missed before.

I would have to go with "A". Same reasons as Zens.